Joe Kennedy Jr. and Ahmad Jamal, Part 2
Kennedy's 1959 WRVA interview on the Frank Brooks Show, transcribed
This one is for the real oral history crate diggers out there. It’s a follow-up to last week’s post about the artistic collaboration between Richmond jazz educator and violinist Joe Kennedy Jr. and pianist Ahmad Jamal.
Here is my own transcription of the brief 1959 conversation between WRVA’s Frank Brooks and Joe Kennedy Jr. on the subject of the LP Jamal at the Penthouse, Kennedy’s career, and the place of the violin in “non-legitimate” music.
Of particular historical interest to me is the reference to the “newly formed Johnny Peyton big band.” Big bands made up of teachers or students (or both) have played a central role in jazz education in Richmond throughout the music’s history: Dave Williams’s Gentlemen of Sound, The Continentals, the VCU Jazz Orchestra, the Devil’s Workshop Big Band. And, of course, Johnny Peyton’s Renaissance Band.
Frank Brooks (WRVA): Fourteen minutes to two o'clock on WRVA radio and the Frank Brooks show. We have someone we'd like for you to meet in just a moment. Meantimely, by way of introduction, here is the Ahmad Jamal trio with several strings. ["I Like to Recognize the Tune" plays.] That's one excerpt from a brand new album by Ahmad Jamal. It's called Jamal At The Penthouse and it's causing quite a bit of talk. And it just so happens that the fella who you might say musically masterminded the whole thing is a Richmonder and his name is Joe Kennedy. And for several weeks now, I've been trying to get Joe Kennedy around to tell us a little bit about the LP. Joe, it's nice to have you with us at the mobile studio.
Joe Kennedy Jr.: Thank you very much, Frank.
FB: Now, did you... You went to wherever this record was made and you supervised the whole thing, didn't you?
JK: Yes, in New York back in February, and it took several days to complete the recording assignment. It was a very wonderful experience. We used selected members from the New York Philharmonic and we also borrowed a few men from Nelson Riddle's orchestra. And it turned out very well I think.
FB: Now, you at one time played with Ahmad Jamal, isn't that true?
JK: Yes. Around ten years ago, we had a group called The Four Strings and Ahmad Jamal was in that group.
FB: And how did Ahmad happen to call on you to assist in this, I guess, his very first recording with a violin string section?
JK: Yes. Well, he had this idea in the back of his mind. And he contacted me in January and I started to write material the second week in January and I completed it the third week of February. And, of course, the last week in February we did the recording work at Steinway Hall in New York.
FB: Well, now, were there certain songs you had in mind, or did you just start from scratch?
JK: No, I had to program and select all of the material that was recorded. And that was very, very challenging in that Ahmad Jamal has recorded so many good songs.
FB: And I suppose it's just a matter of picking and choosing 'til you finally boiled it down to, what, about nine songs yourself?
JK: Yes.
FB: And you have on the album "Comme Ci, Comme Ca," "Ivy," "Never Never Land, "Tangerine," "Ahmad's Blues"... You wrote "Ahmad's Blues"?
JK: No, I didn't. He did.
FB: "Seleritus" and the one we just heard, "I Like to Recognize the Tune" (although I must be very frank--I didn't), "I'm Alone with You," and "Sophisticated Gentleman." Now, that's one that you assisted in the writing of, didn't you?
JK: Well, an uncle of mine [trumpeter Cuban Bennett] and I had written that many, many years ago. And this presented an opportunity for it to be recorded and I thought I would include that in the programming.
FB: Now Joe, have you yourself... Joe—I don't know if people are familiar with your playing; some are, some aren't—is one of the most phenomenal musicians in this, well, anywhere around to be found, in my humble opinion. He is the world's greatest living jazz violin player. You've got to hear this man to believe him and even then you're not real sure. But Joe, have you yourself recorded on an LP somewhere or the other?
JK: This is the first one. Of course, I didn't get a chance to play. It was a matter of doing all of the scoring and conducting. However, last November I had the pleasure of completing a recording assignment in New York with Dick Morgan from Norfolk and on that particular date, I got a chance to play. And that LP, it hasn't been released as yet. I'm hoping that later in the fall it will be.
FB: That's the Dick Morgan Trio and you making it a quartet? Well, that should be a very interesting thing. Dick, of course, along with the trio from Norfolk, will be playing in Richmond tonight along with the newly formed Johnny Peyton big band at Leon's. I'll slip a plug in any chance I get. you watch how carefully I did that?
JK: Yes. Yes, indeed.
FB: Well, Joe, you were satisfied with the overall production after it was all over?
JK: Yes, I really was.
FB: Now, you're a man of many, many talents in music. You do all kinds of things. You write songs, you arrange songs, you conduct orchestras, and you play an awful lot of violin. What is your ultimate ambition? Do you have a particular thing you'd like to see of your own one of these days, a big goal in music?
JK: Yes. Well, I really would like to have various studio assignments. However, I would like to record exclusively under my own name within a large studio framework. And I hope that that will be, well, not too far in the distant future.
FB: Joe, why are there so few, relatively few, people who work on the violin as a non-legitimate instrument?
JK: Well, first of all, it is a classical instrument. And in order to play jazz on it, you have to do some orthodox [sic] things. And I imagine that that is a little bit challenging. And the market of swing violinists as yet hasn't been too, uh, too compensative. And for that reason, I have included that within my pursuits and I have also studied arranging and conducting and so forth.
FB: Well, you play legitimately, don't you?
JK: Yes, yes.
FB: Which of the two fields do you prefer, do you like?
JK: I like them both equally, actually. I had an experience last summer summer at Duquesne University. I had the great fortune of playing with the resident string quartet there. All summer long we did nothing but play Beethoven string quartets and I had a wonderful summer.
FB: You swing 'em a little?
JK: No, not at all. [They both laugh.]
FB: Well, Joe, thank you for coming by! We're gonna play one, maybe two, more from the album just out, Jamal at the Penthouse. The music, arranged and conducted by Joe Kennedy of Richmond with whom we have been speaking for several minutes. And this next one is an item called "I'm Alone with You."
JK: Thank you, Frank.